Today is


   "A word to the wise ain't necessary --  
          it's the stupid ones that need the advice."
					-Bill Cosby

Tuesday, August 23, 2005


Women, Men, Movies, and Romance

My husband and I saw Wedding Crashers this weekend. I was in the mood for a comedy, and I knew ahead of time that this one was going to be raunchy. While too much designed-for-the-male-sensibility raunch generally puts me off, I decided that I'd give this movie a try, and that if it was funny enough, I wouldn't care about the raunch. Well, my friends, it was definitely funny enough. It's not a great film, and the last half hour is rather slow (though it's enlivened by an inspired cameo), but it is an hilarious movie. Vince Vaughn's performance alone is worth the price of admisison.

But this post isn't really about Wedding Crashers. It's about the differences between what men and women find romantic, and, yes, that subject is already a cliche, made quite explicit in the scene in Sleepless in Seattle (an utterly unromantic comedy) where the woman tears up describing An Affair to Remember and Tom Hanks and his brother-in-law have a mock sob-fest over The Dirty Dozen. My husband prompted this line of thinking when he remarked that he was surprised that the crudeness of the humor in Wedding Crashers hadn't turned me against the movie, and that led to a discussion of what women actually find appealing or romantic in films (as opposed to the uninspired, pedestrian fare offered up by most contemporary "romantic" comedies), and then -- since my husband was hard-pressed to come up with a single movie scene he considered "romantic" -- to a question about whether men find anything romantic about movies or whether "romance" was an aspect of the cimematic experience that didn't much apply to men's assessment of the merits of any particular film.

Here's a brief, and by no means exhaustive, list of some of the film scenes that I consider romantic:

* The kiss on the Tuscan hillside in A Room with a View.

* Cary Grant taking Ingrid Bergman in his arms and carrying her down that long staircase at the end of Notorious.

* Harrison Ford dancing with the Amish woman to the accompaniment of the car radio in Witness.

* The look that Bill Pullman gives Sandra Bullock at the very end of While You Were Sleeping.

* The final scene of Breakfast at Tiffany's, accompanied by that lush Hollywood instrumental version of Moon River (which is probably the only theme song in movie history to substantially and all on its own improve the quality of the film in which it appeared).

* Heathcliff (Laurence Olivier) taking Cathy (Merle Oberon) in his arms and guiding her to an open window so that she can see the moors a final time, in Wuthering Heights.

* Bette Davis looking at Paul Henreid as he greets his transformed daughter in Now, Voyager.

Do men have lists like this (that aren't of the Dirty Dozen kind)? Men, feel free to chime in and prove me wrong (or right). Women, feel free to add to my very truncated list with your own suggestions.

Update: I forgot the following:

* Colonel Brandon (Alan Rickman) carrying the sick and heartbroken Marianne Dashwood (Kate Winslett) to safety in Sense and Sensibility. It's interesting, by the way, that this scene doesn't occur in Jane Austen's book -- I find that film adaptations of Austen often render the stories more conventionally romantic than the novels themselves.

* Any time Mr. Darcy (Colin Firth) looks at Elizabeth Bennett (Jennifer Ehle) in the A&E version of Pride and Prejudice.

16 Comments:

Blogger stewdog said...

Haven't seen Crashers yet. Thought it could wait until video.
Do want to see 40 year old Virgin. Sounds great and The Stewdog's bride did a pilot with Steve Carrell and she gave him thumbs up.

August 23, 2005 1:31 PM  
Blogger stewdog said...

Most guys just are't that romantic, especially after they get past around 25. Maybe that's why there are guy flicks and gal flicks.
However, the romance thing has clicked for me without gagging in a couple of movies: When Harry Met Sally, While You Were Sleeping, and About Last Night.
Legends of the Fall was Romantic in a twisted kind of way. English Patient was romantic, but long and boring. Braveheart was quite romantic, especially the early scenes with his bride. Princess Bride! Jerry McGwire! Team America World Police! ('You had me at ___ ___ ___'). Last of the Mohicans. The Wedding Singer. Moonstruck.

August 23, 2005 2:28 PM  
Blogger Madman of Chu said...

It is always dicey to share one's personal tastes with you, Kate Marie, but here you go-

~Eve Marie-Saint attempting to restrain Marlon Brando from fighting with the mob boss at the end of "On the Water Front"

~the scene between Donna Reed and Jimmy Stewart on the phone in "It's a Wonderful Life"

~the press confernce at the end of "Roman Holiday."

~the wedding scene in "Philadelphia Story"

~the scene in "Sense and Sensiblity" when Emma Thompson finds out Hugh Grant is not married

August 23, 2005 2:41 PM  
Blogger Kate Marie said...

You hurt me, Madman, you really do -- especially since I think you have excellent taste (except for that unfortunate Goodfellas thing). And you proved it by listing one of the great romantic movie scenes of all time -- Jimmy Stewart and Donna Reed on the phone with "Heehaw" Sam Wainwright in It's a Wonderful Life. I can't believe I forgot that one! And the rest of your list is no slouch, either.

Stewdog, the most romantic scene in Princess Bride is the bowed and bloody Inigo Montoya standing up, and with increasing force repeating, "Hello. My name is Inigo Montoya. You killed my father. Prepare to die." I thought about the English Patient, too, but I'm always a little creeped out by the fact that (for me) the most romantic scene there is the one of Ralph Fiennes carrying the white-shroud-draped body of Kristen Scott Thomas (or whatever her name is) out of the cave. But maybe it's me who's creepy, and not the movie.

August 23, 2005 2:56 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

That's two votes for Wuthering Heights and Alan Rickman again gets a nod in this category (funny, he seems a very unlikely leading man type but...) in Truly, Madly, Deeply. British film out about 5-10 years ago. He dies and wife is so distraught his ghost comes back. Her life's complete again but he starts to drive her so crazy (with help from a bunch of fellow ghosts), she finds a new boyfriend (a living one) and the last scene is Rickman and all the other ghosts watching her leave with the new man. That was Rickman's plan the whole time, you see, to get her to accept that he's dead and to move on with her life. Very touching.

Overall though, most movies that bill themselves as a Romance or Romantic Comedy fall flat. Most of the time, the woman is the most poorly written character and you can't understand why this guy is beating himself up over her. Her only role in the film is to look beautiful and that's enough for the leading man to move mountains, kill everyone in sight or accomplish some other unbelievable act of heroism (Last of the Mohicans, Against All Odds, etc.)

Movies that had female leads that you actually care about? Gone With The Wind - easy to understand why Scarlet drove them all crazy. The previously mentioned Wuthering Heights - Cathy is so stubborn and driven that Heathcliff has to go along for the ride. To Have and Have Not - Slim and Steve, 'nuff said.

Stewdog, we know you're "past around 25" but you came up with quite a list of movies there. Don't get whiplash doing that 180. I disagree with some of your choices, though, for the reasons mentioned above. Especially Legends of the Fall. Come on, all those brothers after the same personality-free chick? There had to be other women in Montana.

- Dirtbiker for W

August 23, 2005 3:05 PM  
Blogger stewdog said...

But that is the essence of romance. It doesn't make sense. It is a beautuful woman casting a spell over a man. Everyone around him knows she is no good for him, but he persists. Such is the madness of love.

August 23, 2005 3:14 PM  
Blogger stewdog said...

And anopther thing, I didn't do "a
180", I did, as the jocks love to say "a 360".

August 23, 2005 3:15 PM  
Blogger Kate Marie said...

Dirtbiker, I LOVE Truly, Madly, Deeply -- especially the scene where Alan Rickman is waving goodbye to her surrounded by his "dead" friends. And it's got a beautiful score that features a gorgeous Bach cello and piano sonata. Great choice. I actually remember making my husband and Madman watch this movie long ago, and they were polite about it, but their politeness was merely a "don't- disparage-the-chick-flick-in-front-of-the-overly-emotional-chick" mask for their real feelings.

I think you're right about the flatness of lots of what's considered romantic (especially by today's standards). As Stewdog has pointed out, men may view "romance" differently, but for me there has to be some sense of relationship between the two characters, a sense of why they love each other -- which is why I hated Sleepless in Seattle (aside from the fact that the only thing that seemed to be wrong with Meg Ryan's sweet boyfriend in the movie was that he had allergies).

August 23, 2005 3:34 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

OK, I'm a guy way past 25 but here a couple:
John Wayne's courtship of Maureen O'Hara in the "Quiet Man".

Bill Holden and Jennifer Jones in the hillside scenes in "Love is a Many Slendored Thing".

Mentioning Holden, he has to get a nod also for the dance scene in "Picnic" to the music of "Moonglow/Theme from Picnic" with Kim Novak.

In both "Splendored Thing" and "Picnic" the music is also a star in the "romance" scenes.

August 23, 2005 3:42 PM  
Blogger Kate Marie said...

I'm ashamed to say I've never really seen Love is a Many Spledored Thing, but I know it's a fave among certain old fogeys I know and love. :)

I second the John Wayne/Maureen O'Hara nomination.

August 23, 2005 3:55 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anonymous - Thank you for bringing in The Quiet Man (otherwise known as the Best Movie Ever). It should have been at the top of my list of movies that lets the viewer in on the reason Leading Man is so hot for Leading Lady.

As I'm being disagreeable today, I'll have to say that Picnic is misrepresented as a Romance. You can find it in the Horror section. Scarier than The Exorcist, the dancing scene on the dock is so cringe-worthy I have to look away whenever it's on (you may ask why I would even watch it -the other Dirtbiker in the house counts it as a favorite. Opposites attract, I guess). It also falls into the category of "what the heck is so great about her again?" films.

And I suppose that the reason that nobody has mentioned Casablanca here (I'm back on the great movies) is that its like mentioning that the air we breathe contains oxygen; it's a given.

- Dirtbiker for W

August 23, 2005 4:06 PM  
Blogger stewdog said...

OK, the scene in McClintock when John Wayne throws Maureen O'Hara into the mud. Now THAT's romance!
I also mention The Bridges at Toko Ri. . just becase I like it and Willim Holden is in it and Grace Kelly looks great.

August 23, 2005 5:11 PM  
Blogger Winston said...

Ah, to kiss Helena Bonham Carter on a Tuscan hillside . . .

August 23, 2005 7:33 PM  
Blogger Madman of Chu said...

I agree with stewdog that "Team America" is among the most romantic films ever made, but he missed the most romantic line-


"I promise I'll never die."

August 24, 2005 5:29 PM  
Blogger stewdog said...

How could I forget. . .the romantic interplay between Clarice Starling and Dr. Hannibal Lecter in Silence of the Lambs (adapted from Shari Lewis' The Silence of Lamb Chop)

August 24, 2005 10:12 PM  
Blogger Wonderdog said...

I'm in agreement with Stewdog on "Legends Of the Fall".

The scene at the end where the aged Tristin gets mauled by the grizzly bear gets me all misty.

"It was a good death"...

And speaking of Maureen O'Hara, how about Quasimoto flying to her rescue in "Hunchback" -- Sanctuary!

August 25, 2005 9:31 AM  

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